Dear Mayor and City Council,
It has come to my attention that the incident reported by the Detroit News (below) in which Hamtramcks’s Police Sgt. Frederick claimed to have been fired upon and run off the road did not happen as reported.
Since I record all Hamtramck police radio traffic, I was able to review the recording of the incident. What I heard was disturbing.
The recordings are available for download here (mp3 format):
10/08/2005 2:30 AM – 2:59 AM
10/08/2005 3:00 AM – 3:59 AM
10/08/2005 4:00 AM – 4:59 AM
As citizens of the City of Hamtramck, my wife and I are extremely concerned by the contents of these recordings and their implications.
About the recordings:
The incident was recorded on Oct 8th starting at about 2:30 AM. Note that all the silence between the radio calls has been removed to save space.
Thank you for your attention to this matter and feel free to contact me.
Sincerely,
Steven Cherry
Reopened murder case turns worrisome
Prosecutors in decades- old case fret over witness safety after detective is shot at, run off the road.
By Edward L. Cardenas / The Detroit News / October 25, 2005
CLINTON TOWNSHIP — Prosecutors in a 20-year-old murder case say they’re worried about protecting witnesses after a detective helping investigate the case was shot at and run off the road a month ago.
Macomb Circuit Judge Sebastian Lucido on Monday warned the defendant in the case, Kola Hasanaj, 42, to stay away from all potential witnesses as the so-called “cold case” moves forward.
Hasanaj’s preliminary exam began Monday in Clinton Township 41-B District Court on a first-degree murder charge. Police allege he shot and killed his girlfriend, Colleen Smith, in May 1985 when she tried to end their relationship. The preliminary exam was adjourned after testimony from one witness when Hasanaj’s attorney argued he needed more time to review evidence.
Police say Hasanaj drove Smith’s body to Highland Park after the killing and dumped it in an alley. He allegedly removed the back seat, seat belt and carpeting from the rented Ford LTD he was driving to hide the crime before fleeing to Yugoslavia.
Though Hasanaj was a suspect from the start, the case remained unsolved for years until a cold case team from the Clinton Township Police Department reopened it in August. Witnesses were re-interviewed, and Hasanaj was arrested Oct. 13 at Western High School in Detroit, where he was a substitute teacher.
About a month ago, a Hamtramck Police detective — along with Clinton Township police — visited a Hamtramck lounge seeking information about the case. After the detective left the bar, he was shot at and run off the road by someone in a vehicle, Macomb Assistant Prosecutor Steve Kaplan said. No arrests have been made in that incident; the detective was unhurt.
“That leads us to question the safety and health of the witnesses,” Kaplan said. Hasanaj is being held on $2 million bond in the Macomb County Jail.
The only witness to testify Monday was retired Clinton Township Police Officer Leonard Miller, who took the missing persons report on Smith on May 20, 1985. David Cripps, Hasanaj’s attorney, contends his client is innocent and questions prosecutors’ motives for bringing charges after two decades.
“After 20 years, what is different?” Cripps said. “We are perplexed.”
You can reach Edward L. Cardenas at (586) 468-0529 or ecardenas@detnews.com.
Today at 8:22 am:
Ask Crawford about the assault Frederick’s been accused of on Wednesday night at Whiskey in the Jar. A man was hospitalized and Frederick was threatening people on his hit list.
I believe the man attacked is Frederick’s ex-girlfriend’s boyfriend — but I don’t know that for sure.
As we understand it, Frederick attacked Mark Swider early Wednesday morning at Whiskey in the Jar. Swider’s lucky Frederick kept his weapon holstered.
We also heard Swider is dating Frederick’s old girlfriend.
Police and EMS responded and I’ll convert the audio file to an mp3 after I take care of the 200 empty faygo 2-liters on my back porch.
Okay, I listened to the audio. Must be the same incident that Douglas talked about with Sgt. Frederick getting drunk and wrecking a car not too long ago. Is this the same time he left to California or Florida?
It sounds to me like he’s not only drunk, but so wasted to the point of not comprehending his own thoughts on the audio. Why was EMS cancelled by an officer when Sgt. Frederick stated he was hurt? Maybe because he wasn’t hurt like he said, maybe he was just drunk and didn’t know what he was doing? I don’t know, but geez. His speech was so slurred and he acted like no big deal that he was allegedly shot at. He couldn’t even pronounce Mt. Elliott. And to see the city manager’s response. What is going on there? Why hasn’t Chief Doyle done something? Is there a police report on this new bar incident that was referred to? If so does anyone have access to it? Why isn’t he been suspended while they investigated, like the taser officer? The city manager said he was aware and we didn’t hear of any suspensions. Lots of questions I’m sure we won’t get the answers to.
For once (and yes I know I’m asking for it) I’d love to hear from HSS or Joe or whoever the cop is on his take of this deal? Seems like Frederick is one of the good old boys so I’d be interested to think if HSS thinks Fredericks should be fired. Wonder if Rob Cedar thinks Fredericks is a cowboy cop and should be fired too?
Think about it people, Chief Doyle fired Whittie for writing a thank you letter, I would say being drunk like this, with his firearm would be worse then wouldn’t it? Why not the same treatment here? And this bar incident, seems like a pattern with Fredericks. I’m not holding my breath that anything will be done to be honest.
Good reporting Star, we won’t see this in the Citizen or Main Street. You guys get some good information for a couple of bloggers.
Thanks Tom.
As I understand it, Frederick claims that during the first radio call, that he in persuit of a vehicle who’s occupants supposedly fired at him. He says, “I’m Northbound on uhhh… Mt. Elliott. Chasing one who shots fired at me”.
Then he says, “My vehicle is incapacitated … somebody shot .. at me.”
Now usually when a cop radios in and he’s in persuit, you can hear the whine of the motor and you can tell he’s moving. Here the calls “during the chase” and after Fredericks was “run off the road” sound exactly the same.
Frederick thinks he can get away with anything as long as Doyle’s got his back.
“Good reporting Star, we won’t see this in the Citizen or Main Street.” Plus, I can’t read the Citizen at night to keep me entertained while at my night job!!!! (This at least keeps me informed and entertained too) Steven, good observations, on replay I don’t hear any engine roar either and it all sounds the same. He probably just wrecked, then thought “Oh Crap” and then made it up. He sure does repeat the same stuff enough, like he doesn’t think he’s being believed at all. Perhaps you could FOIA the reports all out? Not that they’ll even bother to comply like before.
Was that the only thing the city manager said? Did he even get to listen to the tape? Does he believe he sounds so drunk he shouldn’t have been driving, let alone have a gun? This is a stupid question, did you give this to Doyle too? I’m sure we won’t see Sgt. Frederick commenting to the media about this at all like the other stuff he was on.
That was all Mr. Crawford said. Frankly, I’m surprised he said as much as he did. I am just glad to know that outside agencies are looking into it at this point.
Speaking of outside agencies; Macomb County thought they had witnesses that needed protecting, Frederick was supposedly out “investigating” with officers from Oakland County before the accident, and 10 or 12 police cars and an EMS unit from Detroit responded. Not to mention the awful position he put the other Hamtramck cops in.
Today at 1:44 PM
Actions speak louder than words.
hmm…i wonder if rob means his political views or his activist views
hillary-
“I am just glad to know that outside agencies are looking into it at this point.”
i didn’t gather that from reading crawford’s statement. is frederick’s incident really being investigated?
Crawford is a professional. I’m sure he’s consulted legal and is being extremely careful about what he says.
I think the matter was already under investigation.
Well I’ve read your little story about the alleged attack on the fireman. What a bunch of crap. I was present and he started the whole thing. If it had been me
both the fireman and your buddy the ex-cop would have been taking aride in the bus after they jumped Sgt.Fredrick. You should really take your information and really make sure it’s correct!!!!
I have trouble believing that Swider and Whittie attacked Frederick. Frederick isn’t exactly credible at this point either. He’s lied about his drunk driving.
Does the police report say Swider and Whittie attakced Frederick? I found it interesting that nobody bothered to interview Whittie (or anyone else for that matter). Were you interviewed?
Yes i was interviewed and gave my statmentto the cops. I saw what happened and did not get involved but I know this for a fact. You story of what took place is so inaccurate and one sided you need to re-evaluate your sources of information before you submit such B/S on this web page. You lived here how long? Cause I’m assuming that your the one who is concerned for your safety after only residing here a short period of time. A critic you maybe but one thing for sure is that your not an accurate one. Remeber one thing when you submit information, People with a little piece of knowledge, weel you know how the rest goes. Evaluate and then make appropriate decisions.
So what really happened LINEMAN?
Sorry didn’t get back to you as fast as you would like but I had to attend services. What really happened– just like I said previously. The fireman started it early in the bar and Fredrick wanted to walk away. When he couldn’t walk away well you know the rest. LINEMAN saw the lights go out when there was no other way to go. Purely a true case of self defense. Have a great day and I’ll get back at you when I don’t have important things to do in my life. I read this well, I just read this!!!!!!!!!!!!
Pretend I don’t know the rest. Your story so different from the one I heard I can’t reconcile the two. Please tell the whole story as you witnessed it.
As I heard it, Swider was pulled out of the bar by Whittie and Frederick tried to follow.
What kind of injuries does Frederick have?
From what ive heard swider started with fredrick at new dodge and then followed fredrick to whiskey in the jar where the fight took place. once again, this is just rumor mill but i heard that it was little more then a shoving match that didnt really last to long. its to bad that the police department and the fire departments time had to be wasted for such a silly arguement over a ex/current girlfriend.seems to me both parties need to grow up and move on with their lives.
It appears as if Whittie was present during the “bar incident” according to these posts. Something that wasn’t mentioned before. I think he might be the “ex cop” LINEMAN refers to. I see that there are stories going both ways as to was it Frederick or the fireman who was the aggressor.
LINEMAN said: If it had been me both the fireman and your buddy the ex-cop would have been taking aride in the bus after they jumped Sgt.Fredrick.
So are you saying that Whittie jumped Sgt. Frederick in the bar with this fireman? Was he drunk or something? Steven said that Whittie pulled the fireman out, so was he the peace maker or contributor? It’s unclear what your version is. Please tell, you were there!
LINEMAN: The fireman started it early in the bar and Fredrick wanted to walk away. When he couldn’t walk away well you know the rest. LINEMAN saw the lights go out when there was no other way to go.
It sounds like there was an underlying dispute going on here already over a woman. Sounds like new boyfriend vs ex-boyfriend type of stuff.
STEVEN said: Does the police report say Swider and Whittie attakced Frederick? I found it interesting that nobody bothered to interview Whittie (or anyone else for that matter).
Steven you seem to have info hear to that you’re holding back. What is your source on this? I must say though if Whittie was an attacker here I think he would be interviewed right? Or even better, arrested? This apparently didn’t happen. And you do ask a good question, what injuries did the parties have. Douglas stated that “a man was hospitalized” by Frederick so I’m assuming that’s the fireman? So did Frederick have injuries too, if he was attacked?
STEVEN: As I heard it, Swider was pulled out of the bar by Whittie and Frederick tried to follow.
Sounds more like Whittie was trying to break up the fight than anything. What reason would he have to attack one of his fellow officers like that? Why would Frederick follow if there was an attack by two guys against him?
Not saying who’s right and who’s wrong, but after hearing the Frederick’s audio for his drunk driving accident, I wonder if this too is another story to cover his tracks here…..if anyone has more info, please do tell especially LINEMAN as again you were there!
And has anyone heard if there’s a full investigation being done on this in the PD?
Interesting point Curious, I think you’re right about them growing up. However, if there was criminal conduct then it should be looked into. How are we to have confidence in our public safety if this kind of stuff is going on? Both the PD and FD should be looking at disciplinary action if their members can’t control themselves. This should be looked into along with the crash of Fredericks a few weeks ago.
I want to re-state that I was not at Whiskey in the Jar the night of the Frederick vs. Swider incident.
Tom, a number of readers supplied us with tips and information and wish to remain anonymous.
If there’s a coverup going on with Frederick’s drunk driving crash then why should we trust reports about the Whiskey incident?
Ultimately Doyle is responsible for this mess and the taxpayers are going to be left holding the bag. If Hamtramckans aren’t outraged maybe we deserve this BS.
I’m with you Steven in the outraged department. I would not rule out any cover up after hearing your audio of Fredericks’ crash. I wouldn’t doubt Doyle covering it up either. He’s shown to not be trustworthy whatsoever. I can respect the anonymous tips as I don’t know your source and perhaps someone commenting could face retribution from the PD. (You guys seem to have many more sources than our local Ham-town media does.)
Does Crawford know about this incident too? Seems like there might be an alcohol problem with this guy (Fredericks), crash where he’s obviously drunk and now in the bar getting into it with another.
I just wish that LINEMAN would give a full account of what happened from a to b to c type of thing. I don’t necessarily trust reports either but would be curious to see what it says.
According to Steven, they aren’t really canvassing for witnesses, which makes me wonder why?
By the way Steven, are you putting up audio of the PD that night. Does that have anything on it of value as to what might have happened? (The last one you put up sure had tons of value!)
Ok, I cut the first recording up to the first call in the incident and converted them to mp3:
http://hamtramckstar.com/media/audio/HAMTRAMCK-summary-20051214024000.mp3
http://hamtramckstar.com/media/audio/HAMTRAMCK-summary-20051214030444.mp3
i totally agree that these incidents should all be looked into and that both departments should be handing down punishments. its just sad that the city of hamtramck and both departments have to pay for the actions of these two. now ive only had limited dealings with the police department but i can honestly say that they were nothing but helpful. maybe i lucked out and got to meet the good cops cause im sure their not all bad. but you know what they say about a few bad apples…..
It’s the leadership that’s the problem. Who can blame the working guys and gals for not speaking up? Everybody knows what happens to whistleblowers.
Curious, I’m sure most of our cops are good, it’s like you said a few bad apples. But Steven’s right the leadership is awful. The leadership encourages one to keep things the good old boy way and those who majorly screw up seem to be covered for and rewarded. The good ones who come forward and do good things are harassed it seems. And if one dare whistleblow, like Steven said, we all know what happens then.
Thanks Steven for putting that audio up. I think the audio shows something maybe suspicous. Someone correct me if I’m wrong if I’m not getting it right or someone else gets a different impression.
It seems the station calls a car and states, “Meet me by the station, Yemans side” and then the station calls another car to “10,27″, Yemans side A-SAP” (Does anyone know what 10-27 means? Maybe to go to the station because the two cars were suppose to go to the same place?) Not too long after they call out Yemans side and then we hear a car “10″ calling out for “1″ to respond, whereby dispatch states for that unit to go to Whiskey in a Jar.
Is it just me or did they call the cars to the station just before sending them to a bar fight? Did they know Frederick was involved? I don’t see why they would call cars to the station if there was a bar fight in progress? Isn’t this a delayed response if anything? Or when he says Yemans side, does he mean Yemans side of Whiskey in a Jar rather than the station?
Anyone have any answers. HSS, please pipe in and tell us.
I’m still getting the hang of HPD 10 codes.
10-27 usually means “driver’s license check” and less frequently “moving to another channel”. I’ll have to ask around.
I know HPD usually uses 10-21 to mean mobile phone.
It sounds to me like “station” had a scout car pick him up at the Yemans side of the police station so he could go out to Whiskey in the Jar.
I’m not sure how “station” found out about the fight but I suppose someone called him. It didn’t appear to come through dispatch, instead it was initiated by this pickup. EMS responded too, interesting.
Hillary and I went down to Mt. Elliott and Desner to see if we could figure out where Frederick crashed the PD’s Explorer. No sign of black paint that we could find.
We did find Lew’s Deep hole drilling right next door to Beaver Supply Co.
The Hamtramck 10 codes that are mostly used are as follows:
10-4: OK, or copy
10-5: Officer is taking a short break
10-7: off duty
10-8: in service for next call
10-9: repeat last transmission
10-10: lunch break
10-14: again OK or copy that info
10-21: call the station by phone
10-27: return to station or on there way in
*** no often you hear a “J 1,2 or 3″ after a 10:27 sometimes. This means
J1 – to come in and type a report
J2 – come in with a prisoner
J3 – come in for a break or bathroom break
10-50: auto accident
These are most of them
Thank you, I don’t think Hamtramck’s 10 codes are published anywhere.
When you heard the car 10 that means a supervisor often reffered to as scout 10
Hamtramck uses the following scout numbers for patrol and divides the city usually in half by the north end and south end by Evaline being the divider.
Scout 1 2 3 4 5 6 are the usual numbers usued unless it is festival time.
The command officer sets the numbers at shift time by example…
Scout 1 car – handles south end
Scout 3 car – handles handles roving usually a two man sometimes
Scout 5 car – handles north end
As some may know, hamtramck has min staffing of 3 officers on days and 4 on afts and mids. How the officers are split into cars is up to the command officer.
they are not
after listening to the recording… yes the dispatch called the cars to the station on the yemans side and then they responded to the call.
I wouldn’t look at it as a delayed response but more so as additional officers working to hide the sensitive info that there fellow officer is causing more trouble.
according to the PD contract with its officers, the city has 10 days to charge an officer with departmental charges. Lets see how long they dog it and try and use a lame excuse why they didn’t know or whatever they say to get out of it.
I wonder if anybody will be charged. Everyone seems to be tight-lipped about the bar fight.
The audio of Frederick’s drunken radio report has been downloaded 326 times.
You guys and gals truly need to get a life or run for office. There’s no doubt you have a lot of time on your hands. OKAY here it goes, Swider followed Fredrick. Fredrick didn’t want to be bothered. Left one place went to another. Swider got in his face and grabbed him and Fredrick then defended himself. As for the ex-cop Whitie not invovled just there with Swider. End of story short and sweet and that’s a wrap.
Oh yea by the way to everyone out there have a Merry Christmas and Good New Year.
God Bless us all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I’m more interested in Frederick’s driving drunk on October 8th. The latest word is that he took out 70′ of fence on Mt. Elliott. I wonder who paid for that.
It’s funny that someone who was hanging around in a bar on a Tuesday night is telling me to get a life. Don’t you have hobbies besides Mass and drinking, LINEMAN?
12/18/05 @ 08:23
“If it had been me both the fireman and your buddy the ex-cop would have been taking aride in the bus after they jumped Sgt.Fredrick.”
12/23/05 @ 10:01
“As for the ex-cop Whitie not invovled just there with Swider.”
Which of these stories is true?
thanks to lender for the info on what those 10 codes mean. i only have one question. are those codes being online for everyone to see going to pose a safety risk for the officers on the street? if so then maybe they shouldnt be here for everyone in the area to read. i dont know thats why im asking.
Actually, I’m surprised they’re not already published somewhere. Most codes are listed on this site: http://www.bearcat1.com/radiomi.htm or this one: http://radioreference.com/
Aren’t you starting to miss Ypsi, guys?
No, but I miss Hawkin’s ribs, Dalat, and the Co-op.
LINEMAN, thanks for clearing it up a bit. I got the impression from your postings that the fireman and Whittie both were involved in an attack on Sgt. Fredericks, but it appears from your updated posting that Whittie wasn’t involved, just there with Swider? So are Swider and Whittie friends or something?
LINEMAN said, “If it had been me both the fireman and your buddy the ex-cop would have been taking aride in the bus after they jumped Sgt.Fredrick.”
LINEMAN UPDATED saying, “As for the ex-cop Whitie not invovled just there with Swider.”
HILLARY said, “Which of these stories is true?”
Good question Hillary. I think LINEMAN did clarify a bit to show that Whittie was not involved in some attack conspiracy. There seems to be some differences of fact with regard to who attacked who, but sounds like both need to grow up and stop embarassing our city. Whoever is the attacker should be prosecuted after a good investigation.
On a positive note, it sounds like from what Steven said “As I heard it, Swider was pulled out of the bar by Whittie and Frederick tried to follow.” might hold more truth now since LINEMAN clarified. If what Steven posted is what happened, sounds like Whittie’s “ex cop” instincts were kicking in to alleviate a problem. If this is true it shows that even not being a cop for the time being (I’m sure he’ll be reinstated for the nonsense he was fired for) he still shows some call to duty and loyalty to Hamtramck. I guess there can be something positive about that incident then.
Speaking of duty, has anyone heard whether either investigation about Fredericks (Car Crash or Bar Fight) is occuring?
Merry Christmas everyone!
I kind of doubt the 70′ fence thing. I’m guessing this would have had to have been the chain link parking lot fence next to the gas station on 6 and Mt Eliot. I travel down Mt Elliot more than once a week. That’s a lot of fence to be down and out and up again in a weeks times. Unless the businesses in Detroit have better insurance than I figured.
And Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. It’s been a great year and I hope You’ve gotten used to the area!
steve
this all seems like a lot of speculation and not alot of fact. I’m not trying to be snarky or anything, and believe me i’m not trying to pick a fight. you said at the top of this post that usually you can hear the whine of the motor when a car is moving and that the radio calls during pursuit and after pursuit sounded exsactly the same. You also said that Fredericks sounded drunk and then after that, the call has been refered to as a “drunken call”. I understand that you listen to a lot of police calls via your scaner, but i’m curious to know if that qualifies you to make the types of statments your making. It just seems like you don’t have all the facts and have already made your mind up about what happened based off of assumptions and gossip. Further whenever someone brings up something that could perhaps challenge your assumptions, they are treated like they are part of some sort of coverup or something. I just think that this conversation is starting to border on group think and that you, as the creator of this site, should be especially careful not to become to biased.
Again i’m not trying to offend anyone just some thoughts. Sorry if, it takes me a little bit to respond to any commments. I only check this sight sporatically.
Lee, were you able to listen to the recording? I haven’t yet heard an alternate explaination to Frederick’s slurred speech and confusion but if you have an explaination, I wouldn’t mind hearing it.
Let’s say it’s a little more than speculation. He was drunk that night. It was covered up. He wasn’t disciplined. Steven and Hillary are not too far off. Dennis Frederick gets away with whatever he wants. Jimmy Doyle has let him get away with shit time and time again. This would not be the first time he was drunk and crashed a vehicle.
Dennis has a history of drunk driving, check Macomb County criminal records especially for drunk driving. It’s common knowledge he’s a drunk and does what he wants when he wants and gets away with whatever he wants. Jimmy Doyle letting him get away with shit leads me to believe Dennis has something on Jimmy. If not they’re just boys and Jimmy lets him do whatever he pleases. If this was one of Jimmy’s “non-favorites” such as the thank you letter cop Whitey and/or the taser cop which I believe is Whitey’s friend, Jimmy would be all over it. The media would have it and he’d be telling everyone that he fired the drunken driver cop and how that violates the rules and stuff, but since it’s Dennis Frederick it’s just “a-ok” with Jimmy.
As for the bar fight, why haven’t we heard of an investigation? Why haven’t we heard of why Jimmy Doyle is covering it up? Why Jimmy Doyle is talking to the fireman to make it “go away.”? Why was Dennis wrote up for his conduct after the bar fight for being a drunken jerk, but not for the event itself? Maybe because there would be criminal charges and Jimmy would have to fire Dennis? And why won’t he do that, that’s right it’s Dennis Frederick so it’s okay.
For someone who grew up here, Jimmy Doyle sure is a traitor to his hometown. He fires cops for bullshit like thank you letters but then let’s Dennis get away with this shit. Dennis Fredericks has always been a good investigator, but he makes the department look like shit with his conduct. Both Jimmy Doyle and Dennis Frederick are truly big disgraces to any real cops in town, along with some of his good ol’ boys.
Ok, no life this Christmas so I listened to the recording again and again. I know nothing about the Hamtramck Police department, so I won’t even speculate on names.
First recording – sounds like the guy is impared. Says he was run off the road, shots fired at him. Sounds like he went off the road, traveling north on Mt Eliot near Desner at the Steel factory. Canceled EMS. Something about 600 Chrysler Dr, factured ankle. Call Detroit to go easy. Detroit not answering phone. Sent for tow truck. Hamtramck EMS returning.
Second recording – Someone gets aproved for double time. Someone asks for time on Mt Eliot. “Remain with the party at station”. Ask for date of birth. University, Bi County mentioned. Ask information on Michigan drivers. St Joseph’s? Get information. Priority 2 Southfield. Person from Country Corner Apartments (in Southfield on Southfield Rd south of 13 mile “voluntarily commits” themselves. Canceled? But continuing for something else. “Any of those partys make it to the station yet”. DB unit sent to scene. “Where’s Al”?
Third recording – Car being stripped on Dubois. Somebody called to back up a Livonia unit. Can’t find car on Dubois. St John? Maybe found car. “take that birdy to his office” Some kind of pursuit on Telegraph/Grand River (Livonia again?). Pursuit terminated. West Bloomfield for Beumount/Royal Oak dialysis (sounds like transport of somebody’s kid). Large Industrial truck found.
Probably didn’t catch everthing, but is that about right? The guy could be drunk, had a concussion/knocked unconscience, had a stroke, had a diabetic reaction/low blood sugar, bad reaction to medication, extreme sleep deprivation – granted, he does sound drunk. Though I don’t think you can be cop and have drunk driving on record – even in Macomb.
It is impressive that ten or so cars from Detroit would show so fast; I feel a lot safer now.
“The guy could be drunk, had a concussion/knocked unconscience, had a stroke, had a diabetic reaction/low blood sugar, bad reaction to medication, extreme sleep deprivation – granted, he does sound drunk.”
I’ve wondered the same albin. It seems to me that if any of these were suspected they’d want EMS to respond right away. Instead they cancelled EMS.
“take that birdy to his office” would appear to be when officers tucked Frederick in his office.
Concerned Citizen stated, “Why was Dennis wrote up for his conduct after the bar fight for being a drunken jerk, but not for the event itself?”
Sounds like someone on the inside. Please tell us more. Why and what was he wrote up for?
OK….. Everyone is trying to understand what is up with Dennis and trying to think why Dennis isn’t charged criminally or departmentally.
Lets look at the tape. This tells the most. The first voice you hear is Sgt. Daniel Misiak calling the scout car to meet them at the side door of the station. If you were to look at who was on that night he called for Dennis Nunley the senior patrolman on shift also. Next you hear scout ten “10 dispatch” which is the supervisor Misiak calling for the other car to respond to his location which dispatch relayed and sent the other car to Whisky in the jar. Misiak must of left the station with Nunlee’s car and went to Whisky and the jar and then needed a second car. These things are not reported and should be. The department including the individuals involved have conspired previously to make internal cover-ups. Its the old story of preotect your own, but when they get slapped one day with a lawsuit, it’s going to be oh poor me and help support our cops. What a bunch of bullshit if you ask me. More like a legal cover for a bunch of screw-ups until they get in a jam they can’t get out of.
Maybe Wayne County should have taken them over.
Helpful Lender, that’s pretty good, you must know the parties. If you can would you elaborate on what concerned citizen said, “Why was Dennis wrote up for his conduct after the bar fight for being a drunken jerk, but not for the event itself?”
As for Wayne County taking over, I must disagree. I think most of the HPD are good cops. There are just a few that screw up that the chief covers for that should go. Maybe new leadership would be good and then perhaps the others cops wouldn’t have to cover for the bad ones that get drunk constantly and use up police resources.
I can’t say much, just this, to find out more answers on Mr. drunk, and if he was really drunk that night, sniff around the tow truck company, they did order a tow truck didn’t they? I am betting that tow truck driver could tell alot? okay enough for now, I will help more later.
Tom,
Ok, if this thread progresses, I’ll continue to show you how each one should have lost jobs if need be. At the very least, new command needs to be in place and not to come from rising the through ranks. You have to look at what the pool is to draw from and the other Lt’s are nothing better than Doyle. The Sgt’s get even worse. Dennis was probably written up for something stupid like conduct unbecomming, or some other internal offense. When you send a Sgt who loves to get drink and your senior officer to the call like this, you simply can get Dennis out of it by the following:
Officers on scence spoke with patrons of the bar and found no evidence or comments to susbstantiate the Dennis assaulted the victim. Now we know the bar was full, etc… But when the PD is confronted Doyle would respond with A Sgt was there and even a senior patrolman with over 15yrs on the job and they are going to want you to their word for it. Everyone…. grab your tall boots because its getting deep.
What has to happen, is you have to have a comlainant also. If the other party does not wish to press charges, it goes nowhere.
What the PD needs is a good Internal Affairs person. But as history has shown, they can’t staff it from within and not be biased. Crawford should hire an outside agency to handle internal affairs for Police and Fire and clean house starting with both chiefs.
By the way… Happy New Year!
I don’t understand why the city has not hired anyone to take care of Internal Affairs. Maybe the city cannot afford it? Or do they know that there would be a dramatic change in the departments? I personally think they would do good for the city, but thats just my opinion.
Helpful Info Lender,
I must say that you have quite a bit of knowledge about the HPD, perhaps from the inside I might suspect. But regardless, you have been a great source of information so far. You said if the thread continues you’d say why each person should lose their job. Please do tell why as I think it’s needed to get all this out in the open otherwise nothing will ever change, so please do tell us.
These threads continue only when new information is being brought out, otherwise the thread tends to go away as new threads are created on new issues. I for one am very interested in what you have to say.
When the Sgt. Frederick bar incident was discussed, I can understand that if the victim of the crime doesn’t want to go forward the normal criminal investigation being dropped. However, when it has been alleged that a member, no less a police supervisor, assaulted someone, the chief should move forward with an investigation regardless of what the victim wants. Thank you letters and whistleblowing gets officers fired in the HPD and the chief is adament about doing that, one would think that he would really want to investigate an assault committed by a supervisor. Of course, one would think….
I agree with you that we should get a chief from the outside as I’m sure the HPD is entrenched with Doyle’s people and we’d get more of the same with a chief from the inside. When I say new leadership, I’m refering to an outside chief coming in to provide that new leadership.
I’m also curious about why they should have lost their jobs.
Tom,
I totally agree. At this point in time, everyone should be focusing on Crawford to make the changes. First off, Crawford has to listen to the council to some sort of degree and gets alot on influence even if he won’t admit it. We need to put pressure on the council to push the issue through to Crawford for new leadership.
If I am not mistaken, when Doyle originally took over as Deputy Cheif he had written into his contract that if it didn’t work out he could go back to Lt. I don’t know if this has changed with him in the capacity of chief but someone could FOIA it.
The pressure should be put and worst case make Doyle go back to Lt and get a new commander.
I would have liked to think that Hamtramck could take care of this sort of thing internally, but since nothing has been done about the numerous drunk driving accidents involving Sgt. Frederick, I have to assume the city is not capable of solving this problem without an investigation by outside agency.
We can’t afford to not investigate these incidents. The Police Department needs the support and trust of the public to be effective.
Helpful Info Leader & Hillary, I agree that it is Crawford and ultimately the elected officials who are responsible for not taking any action on any of these things. However, Crawford being new, I don’t think gets who’s upfront and who’s shady. I think brining to light why they need to lose their jobs just gets the information out there to Crawford so that changes can be made. By focusing on Crawford, people would need information to put that pressure on. I would still be very interested in hearing what you know about. With your information maybe that pressure could begin. Thanks.
Also, FOIAs seem to just be ignored, just ask Steven. But it would be interesting to see what Doyle’s contract says. Even if he were allowed to be a lieutant again, he’d be out of the chief’s office and perhaps with the new outside leader Lt. Doyle and his followers would straighten up or have to get out.
I think Crawford is working under the direction of City Council. He reports to them. I am perplexed as to why City Council tolerates drunk driving in city vehicles, but not letters to the editor of the newspaper.
Tom said: “…I agree that it is Crawford and ultimately the elected officials who are responsible for not taking any action on any of these things. However, Crawford being new, I don’t think gets who’s upfront and who’s shady.” and “…Crawford has to listen to the council to some sort of degree and gets alot on influence even if he won’t admit it.”
I would hope Crawford is listening to our elected officials, but you deny them all a lot of credit. Crawford is quite literally a pro at getting to the bottom of who’s who and what’s what, and the council–new and old–ought to know what happens when drastic corrective action is taken up with this police department (cop settlement anyone?). If Crawford (and Council’s) actions are not transpiring as rapidly as we would wish, I would hazard it’s due to a lot of information and responsibility for how to use it that we (thank goodness) as plain old citizens simply don’t have.
I’ll also speculate that the cops-protecting-their-own-phenom is present everywhere and that Crawford knows this firsthand. Shiftlessness (and worse) in Hamtramck’s police department is an age-old problem, and as it’s been suggested in this thread, hiring leaders from within is probably not the best way to correct it. I’ll remention that we did, for a brief moment, have a Chief hired from outside the culture (Melvin Turner), but due to efforts spearheaded by a certain hero cop, he was replaced by what we got.
My point: Hamtramck history strongly suggests that the case for corrective action within our police department must be built carefully and sensibly lest it backfire on all of us.
That said, Interesting stuff in this thread. Let’s hope it will make a(n) (positive) impact.
Let’s keep this New Year happy.
Mike
Council is politically involved in this matter, especially Klein and Cedar. I understand they’ve been named in the latest Whittie suit.
It’s also my understanding that the city’s underwriter won’t be covering this suit.
“Council is politically involved in this matter, especially Klein and Cedar. I understand they’ve been named in the latest Whittie suit.”
The matter I’ve commented on is the Fredericks incident.
Unless there’s a hard connection with the Whittie issue, it’s unclear to me how council is politically motivated in this matter, unless your taking up the cause against Fredericks is somehow motivated by the Whittie issue, in which case I’d say yes, politics are definitely involved here, but not at the hands of council.
“It’s also my understanding that the city’s underwriter won’t be covering this suit (against Klein and Cedar).”
Then I’d say we, as citizens and taxpayers (with the exception of Klein and Cedar), have nothing to worry about.
We’re being sued too!
The larger picture at the police department is that the Council is actively helping the Chief fire every cop that would blow the whistle on someone dirty at the police department, at the same time protecting one of the Chief’s friends who called in a fake shooting and car chase.
How long do you think it should take to get a drunk driver out of the drivers seat of city vehicles? I’m a progressive person, and I don’t think a person should necessarily loose their job for something they did in their free time, but he hasn’t even been put on desk duty! At this point, I don’t even believe this is being investigated.
Michigan Law requires courts to decide drunk driving cases within 77 days of arrest. It’s been more than 77 days. Was Frederick even arrested?
We’re being sued too!
One quik question, By “we” do you mean yourselves or the larger “we the city”
Rob
We as in “citizens and taxpayers”.
“…and the council–new and old–ought to know what happens when drastic corrective action is taken up with this police department (cop settlement anyone?). If Crawford (and Council’s) actions are not transpiring as rapidly as we would wish, I would hazard it’s due to a lot of information and responsibility for how to use it that we (thank goodness) as plain old citizens simply don’t have.”
If you’re refering to the retiree settlement then that was the problem. The council took TOO long to decide to do anything and it snowballed into an $8 million tab on behalf of “we” the taxpayers.
“I’ll remention that we did, for a brief moment, have a Chief hired from outside the culture (Melvin Turner), but due to efforts spearheaded by a certain hero cop, he was replaced by what we got.”
I believe the “hero cop” you refer to is Whittie. He reported Melvin Turner’s VIOLATION OF STATE LAW which caused him to RESIGN FROM HIGHLAND PARK and then later he was DISMISSED by Schimmel. By putting in “hero” I believe (correct me if I’m wrong) that it’s some type of negative swipe at Whittie for reporting wrongdoing? What’s wrong with that? Of course if I’m off base, I apologize but that was my take on the comment. A chief from the outside is a great thing, but a LEGAL AND ETHICAL chief would be good (not like Melvin Turner who was appointed by Mayor Zych and then also to other roles under Schimmel)
Sorry Steven and Hillary got a bit off topic but thought it had to be addressed. In reference to Frederick, no of course the Frederick and Whittie thing are NOT related Mike, but Hillary is right in the comparison. A thank you letter gets one fired in a week or two, we didn’t see the council and manager processing all that information for 3 months before they stepped into that new lawsuit. They blanketly just sat by and did nothing.
However, when an officer is a drunk it takes so much time to process information. I just don’t buy it. And now we’re being told (by Steven) that Klein and Cedar are involved and are being sued in the Whittie thing for something…well, sorry there I go again, I’ll save that for the appropriate thread.
Tom said: “A chief from the outside is a great thing, but a LEGAL AND ETHICAL chief would be good (not like Melvin Turner who was appointed by Mayor Zych and then also to other roles under Schimmel).”
Maybe it came out wrong, but I read this as you dismissing Turner as unethical based on who appointed him (Zych). Not buying it. The HP/Hamtramck double-appointment was Schimmel’s call made while drunk on the powers of Act 72. The fact is, Turner was a responsive, active Chief with three big strikes against him: 1) Outsider to the culture of the department 2) County Sheriff background and 3) Well, I won’t mention three as I may be accused of race-baiting. Yes, the hero cop who got Turner canned was Whittie, and in doing so, a big, big favor was performed for the prevailing culture of the police department, and most notatably (or ironically), for Jim Doyle’s career.
Either way, all water under the bridge. We’re all on the same page on cleaning up the police department. First step, stop choosing sides and spotting motives. The whole department and every officer, patrolman and detective therein deserves scrutiny. Where to start, that’s the only question I have.
As for Hillary’s larger conspiracy theory about the council whacking, so to speak, all opposition to Doyle, so far the bodies just aren’t piling up. In fact, so far the only things I see piling up are lawsuits.
Say, anybody know any good lawyer jokes?
Mike
Mike is making an argument about hiring a chief from outside the department based on the false premise that Turner was appointed chief of police by zych. Turner was appointed as “Public Safety Director” over both the PD and FD, as prescribed in the old charter. Under that system, each department was to have its own “chief”, who reported to the public safety director, who was appointed by the mayor.
The new charter empowers the CM to appoint both chiefs, but it may be a contract issue-with clauses requiring advancing the chief from within. We still have an EFM, under state law, who’s responsible for contract negotiations. Does anyone know the status of the ROA contract, or if and when the council and CM might be empowered to negotiate and make those decisions?
Mike, my point was saying that he was appointed legally by Mayor Zych and then illegal duties by Schimmel. No it’s not implication against Turner simply because he was appointed by Mayor Zych. Upon looking at it I could see how you read it that way, I should have been clearer. Turner was not good though, and no it wasn’t because he was black, it was because he wasn’t a good chief.
I agree we’re on the same side of cleaning up the PD. You said to stop looking for motives. I don’t think it’s a reasonable discussion without motives. For example what are Doyle’s motives for not taking care of Frederick’s? What are the manager’s and council’s motives for not addressing it? What were Doyle’s motives of firing Whittie? Again, why no long evaluation from council on this but there is on the Frederick’s issue? Motives is what Hamtramck operates on unfortunetly. Everyone has some type of motive in some way (even if completely innocent and not trying to do wrong)
“In fact, so far the only things I see piling up are lawsuits” This is why our elected officials should be stepping in and taking action. They’re over evaluation for months and months is hurting us and the only winner is the lawyer who gets to bill, bill, bill.
As for lawyer jokes I got one, the city’s legal representation, that’s a big joke! Too bad the taxpayers are the but of it.
“Yes, the hero cop who got Turner canned was Whittie, and in doing so, a big, big favor was performed for the prevailing culture of the police department, and most notatably (or ironically), for Jim Doyle’s career.”
Mike you’re right. It is ironic. So Chief Doyle should be THANKING Whittie for his job then???? How weird.